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	<title>Comments on: Living Off the Grid With Kids</title>
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	<link>http://frugaldad.com/2009/07/24/living-off-the-grid-with-kids/</link>
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		<title>By: Frugal Dad</title>
		<link>http://frugaldad.com/2009/07/24/living-off-the-grid-with-kids/#comment-44638</link>
		<dc:creator>Frugal Dad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Aug 2010 01:55:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frugaldad.com/?p=3221#comment-44638</guid>
		<description>Bummer, they must have taken the video down. I&#039;ll see if I can find a public video out there somewhere and repost.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bummer, they must have taken the video down. I&#8217;ll see if I can find a public video out there somewhere and repost.</p>
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		<title>By: KCH</title>
		<link>http://frugaldad.com/2009/07/24/living-off-the-grid-with-kids/#comment-44637</link>
		<dc:creator>KCH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Aug 2010 01:40:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frugaldad.com/?p=3221#comment-44637</guid>
		<description>When trying to open the video link, YT says  &quot;This video is private&quot;.  Tnx.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When trying to open the video link, YT says  &#8220;This video is private&#8221;.  Tnx.</p>
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		<title>By: murrayg</title>
		<link>http://frugaldad.com/2009/07/24/living-off-the-grid-with-kids/#comment-44391</link>
		<dc:creator>murrayg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Aug 2010 09:22:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frugaldad.com/?p=3221#comment-44391</guid>
		<description>We&#039;re off-grid in NZ too, but fully interact with the world - one full-time employed.
It&#039;s all about sustainability, as some one said up there, but you can&#039;t be sustainable hooked to a coal-fired power station.
 We once spent a year cruising with two kids (10 and 12 at the time) in a boat with sitting headroom only, one 20-watt solar panel and one small car battery.
 It was, by consent 10 years later, the best year we all ever had. 
 Most people don&#039;t live because they&#039;re too scared.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We&#8217;re off-grid in NZ too, but fully interact with the world &#8211; one full-time employed.<br />
It&#8217;s all about sustainability, as some one said up there, but you can&#8217;t be sustainable hooked to a coal-fired power station.<br />
 We once spent a year cruising with two kids (10 and 12 at the time) in a boat with sitting headroom only, one 20-watt solar panel and one small car battery.<br />
 It was, by consent 10 years later, the best year we all ever had.<br />
 Most people don&#8217;t live because they&#8217;re too scared.</p>
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		<title>By: jarv</title>
		<link>http://frugaldad.com/2009/07/24/living-off-the-grid-with-kids/#comment-44203</link>
		<dc:creator>jarv</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Aug 2010 07:21:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frugaldad.com/?p=3221#comment-44203</guid>
		<description>Just found this site.
I live in new zealand,have 2 kids and live off the grid also.
I have read roberts book,living off the grid is not that hard really.You have to be organised.Really organised.You cant run out of wood as this life for us,we cook,hot water,heat the house.Your day revolves around the fire really.
I dont have solar,its all very basic.
Kids take to this way of life very well,they become creative and just beautiful human beings.They learn where your food comes from and learn how to get it.
The amazing thing about robert is the remote area where is lives.I have been through there,if you have an accident you are buggered.The years he spent he there on is own must have been extreme.The beauty of that country with the complete isolation,That I could not do.
Grow your food,live with in your means,remove your non-essentials.That is the future of the world,watch your kids grow with passion and love.
Take care.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just found this site.<br />
I live in new zealand,have 2 kids and live off the grid also.<br />
I have read roberts book,living off the grid is not that hard really.You have to be organised.Really organised.You cant run out of wood as this life for us,we cook,hot water,heat the house.Your day revolves around the fire really.<br />
I dont have solar,its all very basic.<br />
Kids take to this way of life very well,they become creative and just beautiful human beings.They learn where your food comes from and learn how to get it.<br />
The amazing thing about robert is the remote area where is lives.I have been through there,if you have an accident you are buggered.The years he spent he there on is own must have been extreme.The beauty of that country with the complete isolation,That I could not do.<br />
Grow your food,live with in your means,remove your non-essentials.That is the future of the world,watch your kids grow with passion and love.<br />
Take care.</p>
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		<title>By: marci357</title>
		<link>http://frugaldad.com/2009/07/24/living-off-the-grid-with-kids/#comment-44010</link>
		<dc:creator>marci357</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Aug 2010 14:26:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frugaldad.com/?p=3221#comment-44010</guid>
		<description>Agree - but sometimes it is a matter of money - and affordability of the off-grid systems.
I have a perfect roof for solar - but, my electric bill only runs $35 - $50 even in the winter in Oregon - so at approx $500/yr total for electric bill, how would I ever financially justify putting in an expensive solar system?  Just not feasible. 

For our community however, we have put in a digester to produce electricity from methane and from cow manure.... and this being Moo-town, we have LOTS of cow manure  and the project is working well!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agree &#8211; but sometimes it is a matter of money &#8211; and affordability of the off-grid systems.<br />
I have a perfect roof for solar &#8211; but, my electric bill only runs $35 &#8211; $50 even in the winter in Oregon &#8211; so at approx $500/yr total for electric bill, how would I ever financially justify putting in an expensive solar system?  Just not feasible. </p>
<p>For our community however, we have put in a digester to produce electricity from methane and from cow manure&#8230;. and this being Moo-town, we have LOTS of cow manure  and the project is working well!</p>
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		<title>By: Sue P</title>
		<link>http://frugaldad.com/2009/07/24/living-off-the-grid-with-kids/#comment-43991</link>
		<dc:creator>Sue P</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Aug 2010 08:45:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frugaldad.com/?p=3221#comment-43991</guid>
		<description>I think the goal should be sustainability - not necessarily being grid free. It should be our goal rather than materialism/consumerism. That being said, life without electricity or power is tough. I much prefer air conditioning and computers to not.  I&#039;m not ready to go back to the 1890&#039;s - but I do think we didn&#039;t plan ahead to see where our consumer driven lifestyles were going to get us. Every house in the US should be able to sell electricity to the grid, every house in America should be recycling their garbage, every house in America should be part of an intentional community that works together for the common good. Our #1 goal should have always been sustainability - and then we would be flying high today - instead, we are having to dig ourselves out of a big hole - and we&#039;re not doing very well at that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the goal should be sustainability &#8211; not necessarily being grid free. It should be our goal rather than materialism/consumerism. That being said, life without electricity or power is tough. I much prefer air conditioning and computers to not.  I&#8217;m not ready to go back to the 1890&#8242;s &#8211; but I do think we didn&#8217;t plan ahead to see where our consumer driven lifestyles were going to get us. Every house in the US should be able to sell electricity to the grid, every house in America should be recycling their garbage, every house in America should be part of an intentional community that works together for the common good. Our #1 goal should have always been sustainability &#8211; and then we would be flying high today &#8211; instead, we are having to dig ourselves out of a big hole &#8211; and we&#8217;re not doing very well at that.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex</title>
		<link>http://frugaldad.com/2009/07/24/living-off-the-grid-with-kids/#comment-30396</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Aug 2009 13:45:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frugaldad.com/?p=3221#comment-30396</guid>
		<description>To me just as much egoistic behavior as being a rich doctor living in a big house:</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To me just as much egoistic behavior as being a rich doctor living in a big house:</p>
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		<title>By: marci</title>
		<link>http://frugaldad.com/2009/07/24/living-off-the-grid-with-kids/#comment-29091</link>
		<dc:creator>marci</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Jul 2009 01:50:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frugaldad.com/?p=3221#comment-29091</guid>
		<description>Have friends in Alaska?  Many of them live off the grid and isolated. Mine are a 2 hr boat trip from anywhere/anyone, with only one summer home anywhere nearby. Most of the time they have the place completely all to themselves.  Have to keep shoveling snow off the boat in winter in case of emergency, or get a plane to fly in and land on the bay. 

They have diesel that the haul on the boat for the generator, run sparingly, and gas, also hauled in by boat, and no electric.  The plane drops a bundle once a month in the winter time.  There are a lot of folks doing the same thing there, and in other places, so it is not as uncommon as one might think. 

Here in NW coastal Oregon, we often times go 3-4 days without electric in the winter, stretching to 8 days without 2 winters ago. Cell phones were out for 10 days, and only local landline calls could be made for 10 days.  With a wood stove, for heat, hot water, and cooking, all I worried about was the freezer.  It was cozy, and the family all gathered at my house cuz they knew Mom (me) would have a great stew going on the woodstove :)     Since then I have been trying to can more and freeze less to prevent a major loss of meat.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Have friends in Alaska?  Many of them live off the grid and isolated. Mine are a 2 hr boat trip from anywhere/anyone, with only one summer home anywhere nearby. Most of the time they have the place completely all to themselves.  Have to keep shoveling snow off the boat in winter in case of emergency, or get a plane to fly in and land on the bay. </p>
<p>They have diesel that the haul on the boat for the generator, run sparingly, and gas, also hauled in by boat, and no electric.  The plane drops a bundle once a month in the winter time.  There are a lot of folks doing the same thing there, and in other places, so it is not as uncommon as one might think. </p>
<p>Here in NW coastal Oregon, we often times go 3-4 days without electric in the winter, stretching to 8 days without 2 winters ago. Cell phones were out for 10 days, and only local landline calls could be made for 10 days.  With a wood stove, for heat, hot water, and cooking, all I worried about was the freezer.  It was cozy, and the family all gathered at my house cuz they knew Mom (me) would have a great stew going on the woodstove <img src='http://frugaldad.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />      Since then I have been trying to can more and freeze less to prevent a major loss of meat.</p>
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		<title>By: Kevin@OutOfYourRut</title>
		<link>http://frugaldad.com/2009/07/24/living-off-the-grid-with-kids/#comment-29090</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin@OutOfYourRut</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Jul 2009 01:19:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frugaldad.com/?p=3221#comment-29090</guid>
		<description>Penny Copperwire (32)--A couple of years back a Wash DC psychologist who studies such things said pretty much the same things you&#039;re saying.  She said that schools create the perfect little peer groups, segregated based on age, and forceably homogenized to a degree they&#039;ll never see in adult life.  Her argument was that this very arrangement, accepted without question that it is, generates a great deal of the problems seen in schools.

But to get back to the topic at hand, it probably is best for all of us to make some attempt at incorporating some of the principals of &quot;living off the grid&quot; within the context of modern life.  Few of us have the willingness or ability to go back to a pure live-off-the-land existence but there are components that are desireable, such as detaching ourselves from the media and the popculture to a large degree, spending more time with family and friends, perhaps homeschooling our kids and in general emphasizing self-reliance.  We don&#039;t need to live in the wilderness to do any of these things, but maybe we can make some effort to incorporate the best of both worlds into our own.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Penny Copperwire (32)&#8211;A couple of years back a Wash DC psychologist who studies such things said pretty much the same things you&#8217;re saying.  She said that schools create the perfect little peer groups, segregated based on age, and forceably homogenized to a degree they&#8217;ll never see in adult life.  Her argument was that this very arrangement, accepted without question that it is, generates a great deal of the problems seen in schools.</p>
<p>But to get back to the topic at hand, it probably is best for all of us to make some attempt at incorporating some of the principals of &#8220;living off the grid&#8221; within the context of modern life.  Few of us have the willingness or ability to go back to a pure live-off-the-land existence but there are components that are desireable, such as detaching ourselves from the media and the popculture to a large degree, spending more time with family and friends, perhaps homeschooling our kids and in general emphasizing self-reliance.  We don&#8217;t need to live in the wilderness to do any of these things, but maybe we can make some effort to incorporate the best of both worlds into our own.</p>
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		<title>By: Courtney Ostaff</title>
		<link>http://frugaldad.com/2009/07/24/living-off-the-grid-with-kids/#comment-29089</link>
		<dc:creator>Courtney Ostaff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Jul 2009 23:55:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frugaldad.com/?p=3221#comment-29089</guid>
		<description>@ Squeaky Re: Distance

What I said was that 3 miles &lt;i&gt;then&lt;/i&gt; was about 500 &lt;i&gt;now&lt;/i&gt;.  

I actually didn&#039;t come up with this by myself. 

In a study of distances traveled by populations in various eras, most medieval peasants traveled no further than 3 miles from their homes, on average, in their entire lives. They were walking on foot, laden with provisions for their journey, &lt;i&gt;not&lt;/i&gt; on good roads - most were the equivalent of goat paths.  Modern roads and accompanying infrastructure are more uncommon throughout history than one would think. See also Zvi Razi&#039;s &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0198201907&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Medieval society and the manor court.&lt;/a&gt;

For example, I used to live 1.75 miles (about 2.5k) up a dirt road.  No problem, right? Except that walking home after the bus dropped us off was nearly impossible because there were two hills to go over, and 2 knee-deep creeks to cross, and about a tenth of a mile where you traveled &lt;i&gt;through&lt;/i&gt; the creek bed.  The creeks were commonly used for travel because at least they were relatively flat, and free of vegetation.  You might read &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.amazon.com/Follow-River-JAMES-ALEXANDER-Thom/dp/0345338545&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Follow The River&lt;/a&gt; by James Alexander Thom for more details about this.

Barring major moves or travel, most modern, middle-class Americans will travel no further than 1000 miles in a day (500 miles there and 500 miles back), because that&#039;s the average distance you can travel in a day in a car.  And we are a sedentary, car loving nation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Squeaky Re: Distance</p>
<p>What I said was that 3 miles <i>then</i> was about 500 <i>now</i>.  </p>
<p>I actually didn&#8217;t come up with this by myself. </p>
<p>In a study of distances traveled by populations in various eras, most medieval peasants traveled no further than 3 miles from their homes, on average, in their entire lives. They were walking on foot, laden with provisions for their journey, <i>not</i> on good roads &#8211; most were the equivalent of goat paths.  Modern roads and accompanying infrastructure are more uncommon throughout history than one would think. See also Zvi Razi&#8217;s <a href="http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0198201907" rel="nofollow">Medieval society and the manor court.</a></p>
<p>For example, I used to live 1.75 miles (about 2.5k) up a dirt road.  No problem, right? Except that walking home after the bus dropped us off was nearly impossible because there were two hills to go over, and 2 knee-deep creeks to cross, and about a tenth of a mile where you traveled <i>through</i> the creek bed.  The creeks were commonly used for travel because at least they were relatively flat, and free of vegetation.  You might read <a href="http://www.amazon.com/Follow-River-JAMES-ALEXANDER-Thom/dp/0345338545" rel="nofollow">Follow The River</a> by James Alexander Thom for more details about this.</p>
<p>Barring major moves or travel, most modern, middle-class Americans will travel no further than 1000 miles in a day (500 miles there and 500 miles back), because that&#8217;s the average distance you can travel in a day in a car.  And we are a sedentary, car loving nation.</p>
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